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Thread: Driver's door courtesy switch

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    Driver's door courtesy switch

    Hi folks,

    I have recently come into posession of an '03 1.4 Octavia and the courtesy light switch on the droiver's door is dud. Can anyone tell me if this switch can be replaced, or will I need to change the entire lock mechanism?

    Thanks!

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    Administrator Crasher's Avatar
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    It is not available as a spare part, you could strip the unit down and try and find a new switch and instal and rebuild. Avoid the cheap Chinnese units on fleaBay, they fail, bite the bullet and get a genuine unit BUT firstly check the wires in the door conduit, they do snap and base models without electric windows and factory central locking have a diode in the drivers door wrapped up in the harness and these burn out and cause the same symptom.
    2003 Skoda Octavia VRS Estate. APR 98RON remap, APR R1 diverter valve, Jetex exhaust, K&N panel filter, 7.5x18 Alutec Monstr wheels with 225/40 18 Uniroyal Rainsport 3 tyres.
    2006 Polo GTI 1.8T, APR 95RON remap
    1988 Golf 2 GTI 16 valve, 2.2 with Weber Alpha injection
    1983 Golf 1 GTI 8 valve, 2 litre with Eurospec racing 42/36 head
    1972 1302LS auto 1641cc conversion

    Vile Invention

    Dark was that day when Diesel conceived his grim engine that begot you, vile invention, more vicious, more criminal than the camera even, metallic monstrosity, bale and bane of our culture, chief woe of our Commonweal. How dare the Law prohibit hashish and heroin yet license your use, who inflate all weak inferior egos? Their addicts only do harm to their own lives: you poison the lungs of the innocent, your din dithers the peaceful, and on choked roads hundreds must daily die by chance-medley. Nimble technicians, surely you should hang your heads in shame. Your wit works mighty wonders, has landed men on the Moon, replaced brains by computers, and can smithy a "smart" bomb. It is a crying scandal that you cannot take the time or be bothered to build us, what sanity knows we need, an odorless and noiseless staid little electric brougham.

    W.H. Auden (1907-1973), A Curse:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crasher View Post
    It is not available as a spare part, you could strip the unit down and try and find a new switch and instal and rebuild. Avoid the cheap Chinnese units on fleaBay, they fail, bite the bullet and get a genuine unit BUT firstly check the wires in the door conduit, they do snap and base models without electric windows and factory central locking have a diode in the drivers door wrapped up in the harness and these burn out and cause the same symptom.
    Thanks Crasher. This model has electric windows, but the central locking does not have a remote. I have checked the harness and it seems OK, but I haven't stripped the door down yet. This thing has more electrical gremlins than a Roald Dahl story or Warner Brothrs film. All of the doors have issues; for example the passenger door trips the puddle light, but not the interior light, or the idiot lamp in the instrument cluster. Central locking and mirrors don't work, while the window works occasionally. No wiring issues in the door, so I'm guessing it's a
    failure of the CAN bus module.

    I really need to learn more about this, but it seems that Haynes have decided that it's too much trouble to learn, so they're going to pretend it doesn't exist. Obvious questions would be, if there is damage to a CAN bus pair somewhere in the car, does that disable all CAN bus functions, or can other seqments of the network carry on working?

    I've also got a mysterious permanent drain of around 400mA which is associated with the convenience module, so I certainly have my work cut out

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    Senior Member The Hood's Avatar
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    When you say you have checked the harness does that include inside the gaiter between the body frame and the door? Mine broke where the wires fold and I had all sorts of problems, random alarms, windows work then don't, no cetral locking, rdio speakers popping. I have attached a picture of mine, the breakages were inside the rubber boot.

    The drivers courtesy light failed on my wife's Ford, that meant the central locking regarded the door as open and the central locking stopped working, even with a key. It was a complete unit replacement which meant stripping the door down to just a metal shell with gaffer tape holding the glass.

    drivers loom.jpg
    Last edited by The Hood; 25-10-18 at 07:57.
    Hampshire and Berkshire 4x4 response "Classic" Aqua Blue 140 BHP Elegance 4x4, Park assist,RRP,Spare Wheel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Hood View Post
    When you say you have checked the harness does that include inside the gaiter between the body frame and the door? Mine broke where the wires fold and I had all sorts of problems, random alarms, windows work then don't, no cetral locking, rdio speakers popping. I have attached a picture of mine, the breakages were inside the rubber boot.

    The drivers courtesy light failed on my wife's Ford, that meant the central locking regarded the door as open and the central locking stopped working, even with a key. It was a complete unit replacement which meant stripping the door down to just a metal shell with gaffer tape holding the glass.

    drivers loom.jpg
    Thanks Hood, that is interesting. Checking the flexible links was my first port of call and three are fine, although one has been the subject of a previous, rather cack-handed repair. This was what prompted my question about CAN-bus damage. I know that the twisted pair needs to be terminated with around 120 Ohms and I was wondering how an unterminated segment would affect the entire network.

    Your loom was badly damaged, but it looks from the numerous cracks as if the PVC in your loom deteriorated and became brittle. As I recall it was a thing for a while to break into the Transit Connect by sliding a hacksaw blade into the gap between the driver's door and the A-pillar and cutting the loom, causing the doors to unlock. Sounds questionable to me, it certainly wouldn't unlock the driver's door, but there might have been a spate of attempted break-ins. Perhaps someone here can give more details?
    Last edited by Cogitosus; 25-10-18 at 10:06.

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    Administrator Crasher's Avatar
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    The 1U does not use CAN BUS, there is a limited CAN system in the dash between the radio, ABS, air bags, conv and engine ECU but that is it, the 1Z Octavia 2 uses full CAN BUS.

    The inconvenience* unit does not tend to become an incontinence* unit like it does on the Passat 3B as it is up under the dash so water damage is rare and failure of the connivance* unit is rare.

    *(SIC)
    2003 Skoda Octavia VRS Estate. APR 98RON remap, APR R1 diverter valve, Jetex exhaust, K&N panel filter, 7.5x18 Alutec Monstr wheels with 225/40 18 Uniroyal Rainsport 3 tyres.
    2006 Polo GTI 1.8T, APR 95RON remap
    1988 Golf 2 GTI 16 valve, 2.2 with Weber Alpha injection
    1983 Golf 1 GTI 8 valve, 2 litre with Eurospec racing 42/36 head
    1972 1302LS auto 1641cc conversion

    Vile Invention

    Dark was that day when Diesel conceived his grim engine that begot you, vile invention, more vicious, more criminal than the camera even, metallic monstrosity, bale and bane of our culture, chief woe of our Commonweal. How dare the Law prohibit hashish and heroin yet license your use, who inflate all weak inferior egos? Their addicts only do harm to their own lives: you poison the lungs of the innocent, your din dithers the peaceful, and on choked roads hundreds must daily die by chance-medley. Nimble technicians, surely you should hang your heads in shame. Your wit works mighty wonders, has landed men on the Moon, replaced brains by computers, and can smithy a "smart" bomb. It is a crying scandal that you cannot take the time or be bothered to build us, what sanity knows we need, an odorless and noiseless staid little electric brougham.

    W.H. Auden (1907-1973), A Curse:

  7. #7
    Senior Member The Hood's Avatar
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    The door loom on my Yeti is not unusual, it is a poor design and causes problems across the VAG group wherever it is fitted (try VAG door loom failure on youtube). The holes where the wire passes between the body frame and door are at the same level, this means the wires fold everytime the door is opened and closed if you keep bending a wire it eventually snaps. There are also frequent cases where the loom is fitted too tight which further stresses the wire. The design was changed around 2013/2014 but unless the holes are at different heights so the loom rotates around its length it will be no better. The picture below show the original rubber gaiter which
    is straight and the replacement which appears to have differing heights but are not, because the original holes still
    dictate.

    drivers loom 2.jpgDrivers loom 3.jpg
    Hampshire and Berkshire 4x4 response "Classic" Aqua Blue 140 BHP Elegance 4x4, Park assist,RRP,Spare Wheel.

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    Administrator Crasher's Avatar
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    Well I have had all four arms of the VAG empire come through each day for the last 38 years and I have to say door loom failure is not a big problem. Tailgate loom failure on the Golf 6 is a problem and it was rife on the Golf 3 but my own Octavia 1 has 181k on it (at around 3 miles per journey each day for the last ten years) and the drivers door loom is fine and by my standards that is awesome.
    2003 Skoda Octavia VRS Estate. APR 98RON remap, APR R1 diverter valve, Jetex exhaust, K&N panel filter, 7.5x18 Alutec Monstr wheels with 225/40 18 Uniroyal Rainsport 3 tyres.
    2006 Polo GTI 1.8T, APR 95RON remap
    1988 Golf 2 GTI 16 valve, 2.2 with Weber Alpha injection
    1983 Golf 1 GTI 8 valve, 2 litre with Eurospec racing 42/36 head
    1972 1302LS auto 1641cc conversion

    Vile Invention

    Dark was that day when Diesel conceived his grim engine that begot you, vile invention, more vicious, more criminal than the camera even, metallic monstrosity, bale and bane of our culture, chief woe of our Commonweal. How dare the Law prohibit hashish and heroin yet license your use, who inflate all weak inferior egos? Their addicts only do harm to their own lives: you poison the lungs of the innocent, your din dithers the peaceful, and on choked roads hundreds must daily die by chance-medley. Nimble technicians, surely you should hang your heads in shame. Your wit works mighty wonders, has landed men on the Moon, replaced brains by computers, and can smithy a "smart" bomb. It is a crying scandal that you cannot take the time or be bothered to build us, what sanity knows we need, an odorless and noiseless staid little electric brougham.

    W.H. Auden (1907-1973), A Curse:

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crasher View Post
    The 1U does not use CAN BUS, there is a limited CAN system in the dash between the radio, ABS, air bags, conv and engine ECU but that is it,
    Well now Crasher I hate to introduce a note of discord so early in our relationship, but I'm afraid you're plain wrong on that one. Mine is definitely a 1U and I's got CAN-bus all the ways out to me peripherals, so I has.

    The wiring matches up quite well to the Haynes manual although they have some issues telling their Lefts from their Rights and their driver's side from their passenger side. There's a sort of CAN-bus concentrator in each of the window motors that seems to exchange return data with Head Office. I do have to thank you for forcing me to get off my backside and actually bell out the wiring in the front passenger door. I was wrong in my original guesswork, er, I mean diagnosis, as the puddle light - which is the only part of the door working correctly - is not locally switched, but is fed entirely from the Discomfort module. So why doesn't it trigger the courtesy light? Hmm.

  10. #10
    Administrator Crasher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crasher View Post
    The 1U does not use CAN BUS, there is a limited CAN system in the dash between the radio, ABS, air bags, conv and engine ECU
    As I said, it is not a proper CAN BUS system with a central controller network unit where all CAN enabled systems can communicate through via CAN high and CAN low systems in convenience, drive train and infotainment groups, this system is on the 1Z. The 1U has a local data BUS system which Haynes 4285 erroneously describes as being a CAN BUS although VAG variously label it as CANH and CANL, H BUS or L BUS and A BUS and B BUS, they can’t make their minds up but at now point on the current flow diagram is it called a CAN BUS. Taking the Haynes comic schematic interpretation of the VAG current flow diagram on page 12.28 as an example, the "J393 Convenience electric central control unit" and "J386/J387/J388 and J389" door control units communicate through the instruments, the VAG current flow diagram in ELSA WIN shows the Lilac and Lilac/white wires from the door controller and convenience units all merging at the back of the dash panel J218 as coupling points W29 (A BUS) and W30 (B BUS), this is how on my VRS with the matrix display it can show all six flaps status as the bonnet and tailgate also are linked to the dash but the bonnet is a direct earth signal to the dash and the tailgate open earth signal goes into the J393 and this sends a CAN signal to the dash.
    The convenience unit also has a speed signal for door lock triggering plus air bag for emergency door opening, these are all direct feeds where a proper CAN BUS car uses the CAN BUS network.
    2003 Skoda Octavia VRS Estate. APR 98RON remap, APR R1 diverter valve, Jetex exhaust, K&N panel filter, 7.5x18 Alutec Monstr wheels with 225/40 18 Uniroyal Rainsport 3 tyres.
    2006 Polo GTI 1.8T, APR 95RON remap
    1988 Golf 2 GTI 16 valve, 2.2 with Weber Alpha injection
    1983 Golf 1 GTI 8 valve, 2 litre with Eurospec racing 42/36 head
    1972 1302LS auto 1641cc conversion

    Vile Invention

    Dark was that day when Diesel conceived his grim engine that begot you, vile invention, more vicious, more criminal than the camera even, metallic monstrosity, bale and bane of our culture, chief woe of our Commonweal. How dare the Law prohibit hashish and heroin yet license your use, who inflate all weak inferior egos? Their addicts only do harm to their own lives: you poison the lungs of the innocent, your din dithers the peaceful, and on choked roads hundreds must daily die by chance-medley. Nimble technicians, surely you should hang your heads in shame. Your wit works mighty wonders, has landed men on the Moon, replaced brains by computers, and can smithy a "smart" bomb. It is a crying scandal that you cannot take the time or be bothered to build us, what sanity knows we need, an odorless and noiseless staid little electric brougham.

    W.H. Auden (1907-1973), A Curse:

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